A 12 year old problem returns

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A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list
Hi All,

About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).

Thanks!

Warren Nagourney
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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

Ross Moore-3
Hello Warren,

On 30/05/2020, at 5:24, "Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi All,

About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).

What type of document is it?
It a book, or long article with extensive frontmatter, such as Tables of Contents, Figures, etc.
which are not there on the first run, the Preview may well seem to jump as these are created and included on the next run. 
Similarly as cross-references are resolved into meaningful anchor text, pagination can change, affecting also float placement. Again this can cause the Preview to seem to move to a different page when it is actually the same numbered (virtual) page.

Hope this helps.

 Ross

Thanks!

Warren Nagourney
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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list


On May 29, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Ross Moore <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Warren,

On 30/05/2020, at 5:24, "Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi All,

About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).

What type of document is it?
It a book, or long article with extensive frontmatter, such as Tables of Contents, Figures, etc.
which are not there on the first run, the Preview may well seem to jump as these are created and included on the next run. 
Similarly as cross-references are resolved into meaningful anchor text, pagination can change, affecting also float placement. Again this can cause the Preview to seem to move to a different page when it is actually the same numbered (virtual) page.

Hope this helps.

 Ross

Thanks!

Warren Nagourney
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Thanks very much for replying, Ross. The document is a book using OUP formatting (though Oxford will probably not publish it). The problem arose very recently even though I have been working on the book for more than a year. I didn’t add anything recently which requires cross-references and haven’t added any references yet. 

I just updated all my packages using the TeX Live Utility and the problem seems to have settled down - it might have been fixed. Since it was sporadic, I won’t know for a little while whether that is the case.

Thanks again,

wn




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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

Herbert Schulz
In reply to this post by MacOSX-TeX mailing list
> On May 29, 2020, at 2:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Warren Nagourney

Howdy,

There hasn't been the need for a package to be loaded in a very long time (what was your last distribution?).

Make sure TeXShop is using SyncTeX for synchronization: see Sync method on the typesetting Tab of TeXShop->Preferences. This is what is needed ever since TeX Live 2010 so your may be set incorrectly

Good Luck,

Herb Schulz
(herbs at wideopenwest dot com)

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list

> On May 29, 2020, at 3:38 PM, Herbert Schulz <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On May 29, 2020, at 2:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Warren Nagourney
>
> Howdy,
>
> There hasn't been the need for a package to be loaded in a very long time (what was your last distribution?).
>
> Make sure TeXShop is using SyncTeX for synchronization: see Sync method on the typesetting Tab of TeXShop->Preferences. This is what is needed ever since TeX Live 2010 so your may be set incorrectly
>
> Good Luck,
>
> Herb Schulz
> (herbs at wideopenwest dot com)
>
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I have been fairly up to date with my distributions. I had been using TeXLive 2019 and, after having the problem, upgraded to 2020. I have been using SyncTex for quite some time (probably since it was released).

I think I used the wrong term - I didn’t load any packages.. I used the TeXLive Utility to Update All Packages in the Actions menu. It took a while before the Updates panel became empty.

So far, TeXShop seems to work well. It hasn’t “jumped” in a while.

Thanks for your suggestions.

wn

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list


> On May 29, 2020, at 9:18 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>> On May 29, 2020, at 3:38 PM, Herbert Schulz <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> On May 29, 2020, at 2:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Warren Nagourney
>>
>> Howdy,
>>
>> There hasn't been the need for a package to be loaded in a very long time (what was your last distribution?).
>>
>> Make sure TeXShop is using SyncTeX for synchronization: see Sync method on the typesetting Tab of TeXShop->Preferences. This is what is needed ever since TeX Live 2010 so your may be set incorrectly
>>
>> Good Luck,
>>
>> Herb Schulz
>> (herbs at wideopenwest dot com)
>>
>> ----------- Please Consult the Following Before Posting -----------
>> TeX FAQ: http://www.tex.ac.uk/faq
>> List Reminders and Etiquette: https://sites.esm.psu.edu/~gray/tex/
>> List Archives: http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.comp.tex.macosx
>>               https://email.esm.psu.edu/pipermail/macosx-tex/
>> TeX on Mac OS X Website: http://mactex-wiki.tug.org/
>> List Info: https://email.esm.psu.edu/mailman/listinfo/macosx-tex
>
> I have been fairly up to date with my distributions. I had been using TeXLive 2019 and, after having the problem, upgraded to 2020. I have been using SyncTex for quite some time (probably since it was released).
>
> I think I used the wrong term - I didn’t load any packages.. I used the TeXLive Utility to Update All Packages in the Actions menu. It took a while before the Updates panel became empty.
>
> So far, TeXShop seems to work well. It hasn’t “jumped” in a while.
>
> Thanks for your suggestions.
>
> wn
>
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I am afraid I spoke too soon. The page jumps are back. They are fairly annoying, since they interrupt the flow of writing. Any suggestions welcome,

Thanks!

Warren Nagourney
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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

Herbert Schulz
> On May 30, 2020, at 9:54 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> I am afraid I spoke too soon. The page jumps are back. They are fairly annoying, since they interrupt the flow of writing. Any suggestions welcome,
>
> Thanks!
>
> Warren Nagourney

Howdy,

Is there a way you can supply me with a docment that shows this behavior and instructions on how to reproduce the problem? Does it happen when you re-compile or when you sync between Source and Preview?

Good Luck,

Herb Schulz
(herbs at wideopenwest dot com)

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list


> On May 31, 2020, at 4:56 AM, Herbert Schulz <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On May 30, 2020, at 9:54 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I am afraid I spoke too soon. The page jumps are back. They are fairly annoying, since they interrupt the flow of writing. Any suggestions welcome,
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Warren Nagourney
>
> Howdy,
>
> Is there a way you can supply me with a docment that shows this behavior and instructions on how to reproduce the problem? Does it happen when you re-compile or when you sync between Source and Preview?
>
> Good Luck,
>
> Herb Schulz
> (herbs at wideopenwest dot com)
>
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Thanks for your help, but the problem is not very reproducible and right now occurs very sporadically. If I find a way of reproducing the problem I can send you the document I am currently working on (a book on elementary quantum electrodynamics).

When it does happen, it occurs immediately after finishing typesetting. I will make a change in the source, type cmd-T, it will pause for few seconds while typesetting and the preview screen (on a different monitor from the source) will jump a page to two (as soon as it finishes typesetting).

Thanks again.

wn

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

Ross Moore-3
Hi Warren.

On 1 Jun 2020, at 8:25 am, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks for your help, but the problem is not very reproducible and right now occurs very sporadically. If I find a way of reproducing the problem I can send you the document I am currently working on (a book on elementary quantum electrodynamics).

When it does happen, it occurs immediately after finishing typesetting. I will make a change in the source, type cmd-T, it will pause for few seconds while typesetting and the preview screen (on a different monitor from the source) will jump a page to two (as soon as it finishes typesetting).

This sounds like you may be getting different paginations on successive runs.
That is certainly possible, when you have quite long footnotes, perhaps including a citation
or cross-reference. 

For example, the presence of the footnote at the bottom of one page may push it’s \footnote anchor onto the next page.
Then on the next run, the footnote is no longer needed on the prior page, which then means there is room
for the anchor text, so the pagination changes. That could have a knock-on effect for the start of a (sub-)section,
so creates changes also in the TOC.

To check for this kind of effect, save a copy of the PDF under a new name.
Process again, and check that both PDFs have the same number of pages.
If not, visually compare them until you find where they differ.
Try to relate that to auto-generated content, rather than input text.


Thanks again.

wn

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Hope this helps.
Stay safe.

Ross

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list


On May 31, 2020, at 3:37 PM, Ross Moore <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Warren.

On 1 Jun 2020, at 8:25 am, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks for your help, but the problem is not very reproducible and right now occurs very sporadically. If I find a way of reproducing the problem I can send you the document I am currently working on (a book on elementary quantum electrodynamics).

When it does happen, it occurs immediately after finishing typesetting. I will make a change in the source, type cmd-T, it will pause for few seconds while typesetting and the preview screen (on a different monitor from the source) will jump a page to two (as soon as it finishes typesetting).

This sounds like you may be getting different paginations on successive runs.
That is certainly possible, when you have quite long footnotes, perhaps including a citation
or cross-reference. 

For example, the presence of the footnote at the bottom of one page may push it’s \footnote anchor onto the next page.
Then on the next run, the footnote is no longer needed on the prior page, which then means there is room
for the anchor text, so the pagination changes. That could have a knock-on effect for the start of a (sub-)section,
so creates changes also in the TOC.

To check for this kind of effect, save a copy of the PDF under a new name.
Process again, and check that both PDFs have the same number of pages.
If not, visually compare them until you find where they differ.
Try to relate that to auto-generated content, rather than input text.


Thanks again.

wn

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Hope this helps.
Stay safe.

Ross
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Good morning Ross,

I actually don’t use footnotes (sometimes I think I should) but do use a few figures. Occasionally, the pagination changes due to the way floats work. I also haven’t set up any references yet and don’t have a reference page (I just put “[]” marks where there should be a reference and will put them later).

Thanks for your suggestions! I just wish remembered what fixed the problem 12 years ago.

Best regards,

wn

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list
In reply to this post by MacOSX-TeX mailing list

> On May 29, 2020, at 12:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Warren Nagourney
> ----------- Please Consult the Following Before Posting -----------
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Hello again,

The problem of TeXShop preview jumping several pages after typesetting has returned with a vengeance. There is one common theme to the problem - it always happens after there has been an error. After correcting the error, preview will jump for the next couple of typesets and then settle down. I am on the latest versions of everything, I believe.

Any suggestions?

Thanks very much!

Warren Nagourney

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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

koch@uoregon.edu
Responding to Warren Nagourney:

Every so often I run into this exact problem, and I worry about the bug for a couple of hours before remembering the cause. In every case I've examined, the cause is simple:

A typesetting error required trashing the aux file, or produced an incomplete aux file. Without that aux file, tables of contents, lists of illustrations, and the like cannot be created, so the document is missing several pages at the start. The material I am working on is on the 97th page of the document (say), but without the table of contents and other preliminaries it is only on page 92. But TeXShop returns to page 97 and thus seems to jump ahead.

Once you remember the cause, you can fix it. If the material on page 97 is very tricky and causes you to make lots of TeX errors, comment out the table of contents and the table of illustrations temporarily. Then you'll always return to the right spot. After you have finished the tricky material, remove the comments

Richard Koch

> On Sep 3, 2020, at 4:46 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>> On May 29, 2020, at 12:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Warren Nagourney
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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

Ross Moore-3
Hi Richard, Warren

On 4 Sep 2020, at 11:54 am, [hidden email] wrote:

Responding to Warren Nagourney:

Every so often I run into this exact problem, and I worry about the bug for a couple of hours before remembering the cause. In every case I've examined, the cause is simple:

A typesetting error required trashing the aux file, or produced an incomplete aux file. Without that aux file, tables of contents, lists of illustrations, and the like cannot be created, so the document is missing several pages at the start. The material I am working on is on the 97th page of the document (say), but without the table of contents and other preliminaries it is only on page 92. But TeXShop returns to page 97 and thus seems to jump ahead.

Once you remember the cause, you can fix it. If the material on page 97 is very tricky and causes you to make lots of TeX errors, comment out the table of contents and the table of illustrations temporarily. Then you'll always return to the right spot. After you have finished the tricky material, remove the comments

The simple lesson is that:

  “after an error, rerun LaTeX 3 times (or more) before looking for more issues”.

If you are using  latexmk  or similar script, you would be automatically getting multiple runs after the error.

Dick’s explanation tells you why you need these multiple runs.


Hope this helps.

Ross


Richard Koch

> On Sep 3, 2020, at 4:46 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>> On May 29, 2020, at 12:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Warren Nagourney
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Re: A 12 year old problem returns

MacOSX-TeX mailing list


On Sep 3, 2020, at 7:06 PM, Ross Moore <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Richard, Warren

On 4 Sep 2020, at 11:54 am, [hidden email] wrote:

Responding to Warren Nagourney:

Every so often I run into this exact problem, and I worry about the bug for a couple of hours before remembering the cause. In every case I've examined, the cause is simple:

A typesetting error required trashing the aux file, or produced an incomplete aux file. Without that aux file, tables of contents, lists of illustrations, and the like cannot be created, so the document is missing several pages at the start. The material I am working on is on the 97th page of the document (say), but without the table of contents and other preliminaries it is only on page 92. But TeXShop returns to page 97 and thus seems to jump ahead.

Once you remember the cause, you can fix it. If the material on page 97 is very tricky and causes you to make lots of TeX errors, comment out the table of contents and the table of illustrations temporarily. Then you'll always return to the right spot. After you have finished the tricky material, remove the comments

The simple lesson is that:

  “after an error, rerun LaTeX 3 times (or more) before looking for more issues”.

If you are using  latexmk  or similar script, you would be automatically getting multiple runs after the error.

Dick’s explanation tells you why you need these multiple runs.


Hope this helps.

Ross


Richard Koch

> On Sep 3, 2020, at 4:46 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
> 
> 
>> On May 29, 2020, at 12:23 PM, Warren Nagourney via MacOSX-TeX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi All,
>> 
>> About 12 years ago, I was having problems with a side effect of typesetting using pdflatex and all the sync options: the preview screen would jump a few pages immediately after typesetting. Looking back at my old emails, I think refreshing the version of pdfsync.sty (or something like this) solved it. The problem has come back. Does anyone know what is happening? (I just installed the full TeXLive 2020 and am using TeXshop).
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Warren Nagourney
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Thanks everyone for your help! I commented out the table of contents command and it seems to work fine after errors.  I will keep the command commented out since I rarely need to refer to the table of contents.

Cheers,

Warren Nagourney

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